In a Data-Dominated World, B2B Branding is Making a Big-Time Comeback: Karen O'Mahoney

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Mark Evans: You're listening to Marketing Spark, the podcast that delivers insight, tools, and tips for marketers and entrepreneurs in the trenches in twenty minutes or less. In a marketing world increasingly dominated by data, branding still matters. Karen O'Malley, the CEO and founder of BrandLucent Montreal, heads up a strategic branding agency that works with b to b tech companies to harness the power of their authentic brand. Welcome to Marketing Spark.

Karen O'Mahoney: Hi, Mark. Thanks for having me.

Mark Evans: As I said off the top, in a b to b world dominated by data, I'm curious about your thoughts on the state of branding. How much of a focus are b to b companies putting on branding these days given the fact that there's so much noise, there's so much content, there's so much social media out there?

Karen O'Mahoney: What I actually find that a lot of people really have honed in on their brand and because of that, right, because there's because of all the noise, really. And what we want, what we see a lot in a lot of companies is that they're really starting to focus in on back to the core, back to what really makes them different. When you think about brand, it's a company's DNA. It's impacting, like, sales and marketing, but also, obviously, has its place in leadership and decision making and direction. So for a lot of people, it's coming back to what do I want my company to be, where is my company direction taking me, and how does that affect all of our teams? So everything from product teams to development to HR operations, the whole company. And so from that point of view, we find that a lot of b two b companies are coming back to their brand and really starting to think about it a lot more to say, okay. Well, we have the power in our hands to really wield this company and adapt to whatever landscape comes up. But now we wanna see where we wanna take this and where our vision is gonna go.

Mark Evans: So before we move forward, let's take a step back to why are brands coming back to the brand? I mean, it strikes me as as a brand person myself is that brand is always important. Brands should always be part of what you do and how you position yourself. Why are they coming back? What does that mean? Does that mean they they didn't pay attention to brand? They were focused on other things? Maybe provide a little bit of context.

Karen O'Mahoney: Yeah. For sure. So I think what it is a lot of the time, it's people are thinking about their brand as one and done. Right? So it's like a lot of the time, they will think about doing a brand strategy, for example, and they'll say, oh, you know, we've done it, like, a while back. And they're like, that's been fine. Right? It's it's kept us going so far. It's kept us going for the last few years, and they take that, and you can bring out a lot of these brand strategies and messages through marketing, through content, through all of the ways that you're engaging. But the thing is what they're they have been noticing over time is as the company grows, as it changes, it's now time to refocus and say, okay. Well, we've changed. We've grown. We've, started to open to new markets. We've started to look at different directions. And that's where it's coming back to the brand strategy, I would say. Not I should explain that. It's coming back to a brand strategy to see where next. Right? So it's it's keeping that focus on on a a point in the future. The minute the point in the future is suddenly behind you, you should have done your brand strategy again. Right? So it's like that idea of, like, keeping it ahead of you so that you can continue to have it as your north star.

Mark Evans: So how do brands not adopt the one and done or our brand is written in stone approach. Because, you know, as you know well, I'm being immersed in this. It's brand is very fluid. It's very dynamic. Mhmm. It evolves over time, and it and it and it can evolve very quickly. So you you always have to be on top of it to make sure that your brand is relevant, it resonates, and it's aligned with the way that people are thinking and talking and and acting. From your perspective, how do brands make sure that they're they're always being brand focused? They're always making sure that their brand is is fresh and up to date.

Karen O'Mahoney: Yeah. So, I mean, from our point of view, it's coming from that central core. Right? So it's coming from that central leadership team and moving out from there. So the first thing is commitment. It's really saying, okay. Well, are we committing to where our brand is gonna take us? And if that's the case, let's keep it relevant. Let's keep on top of it. Let's build it into our company values. Let's build it into our company goals and start to actually reflect that in all of our departments. So this is that idea of having your brand be something that's actually adopted and taken to actually run your company. And I think a lot of people see brand a lot of the time in terms of marketing only, and they don't see it in terms of the full part of your company. So when, you know, the marketing and the messages around marketing can adapt as long as they're still on brand. Right? You know, you can have campaigns that are about different things as long as they are within the brand, DNA itself. Right? So they don't go against the brand values. They don't go against the company mission. They don't go against the company purpose. However, what we don't see a lot of the time is maybe people adopting the brand across their companies, and that's something that we try to help people to do, which is to build in those company goals, for each department around the actual brand itself. So it's the adoption and the actual usage of the brand in an everyday sense. And that's how you keep it relevant, one, to the employees, but also to everyone you work with. Because, again, if your employees understand the brand, they're living it as well. Right? So if you imagine you're an operations person, you understand the brand, you live the brand, you talk about the brand, you work with your teams, and you operate within the brand structure. Now whenever you every time you work with a client, for example, you're gonna bring that same dynamic. You're gonna bring that same element of the brand with you. So that experience translates across how we work every day as well.

Mark Evans: One other question I wanted to ask you in terms of making sure that all employees and all departments are aware of the brand and brand strategy is how do you make that happen? How do you make them aware of the fact that this is something important, this is something that needs to be reflected in their work? So for example, you know, I talk a lot about Mailchimp and what they do as far as as brand purse buyer persona. So what they'll do in their office is they've got these big posters with different types of customers to remind all their employees that these are the people that matter.

Karen O'Mahoney: Yeah.

Mark Evans: These are the people that you should be focused on when you're doing sales or marketing or customer success. So how do you apply that same approach to a company to make sure that your brand is not only living and breathing, but all your employees are always aware of the importance of brand and how it has to be an integral part of how they work.

Karen O'Mahoney: Yeah. And Mailchimp is a great example. I I really like Mailchimp's brand. And anytime I've ever gone to an event where they've had experiential booths and stuff, it's always been fantastic. But yeah. So back to your question. Yeah. So if I think about it, it's like when we talk about your brand living across the whole company and reminding people of those things, we want that to come from the departments themselves. And how do you do that? Right? So you get commitment from the top down, first of all. So there's no point in having and I've done this in the past where, you know, I was part of a a branding exercise within a department, and we didn't have necessarily buy in from the top levels of leadership. That's why we always work with leadership because we wanna make sure that whatever we commit to is something we can deliver on. So that's the first step. Right? So we get commitment from the top first. Then from there, you wanna build your team of brand ambassadors. And we do this in in BrandVoosen ourselves. We have, a one day workshop that we take people through. Now you have to remember that when your brand changes and even a slight change in your brand, can have a huge effect on the employees. Right? So it's gonna say, okay. Well, I thought we were about this stuff, and now we're kinda slightly changing direction, or how does that impact my job? So there's a lot of change management that goes into that, and you're basically trying to understand who's, you know, who's on board, how can we convert those people into brand ambassadors from a point of view so that they are engaged and that they can adopt us. So from there, right, so you're kind of getting this idea of, like, okay. You're helping them understand that. You're helping them see how it's relevant. You're helping them see why why we're doing the things that we're doing throughout this workshop or however you want to create your brand ambassadors. And then from there, you want them to build, their own goals for their own departments that are relevant to them. For sure, having those, you know, buyer personas, around the office and all of that stuff, obviously, COVID is changing that now. But having things that are relevant, having your values somewhere visible, having your mission somewhere visible, having your vision, talking about things a lot, but then having each department actually come up with their own goals and saying, okay. Well, how do I want to live this value? Right? How do we want to reflect this company piece, this part of our brand in how we work? And have them see how that can translate. Because, again, we can come in as branding experts and tell them, here are some examples. That's great. But at the same time, when it comes to the day to day, they are the experts in what they do. So now we want them to come up with ideas and to help nourish those ideas around how are they gonna make the brand a reality for every stakeholder that they work with, every partner that they work with, every client that they work with.

Mark Evans: One of the questions that I've asked people on this podcast over the last, I guess, eight months since COVID emerged is how has their business or how have their clients changed post COVID? And I I don't know whether that's a relevant question anymore given the fact this is the new reality. This is the world in which we operate. But have you seen a discernible difference in what your clients or what your new customers are doing now when it comes to brand versus what they were doing nine months ago, a year ago?

Karen O'Mahoney: I think what we've noticed is actually, like, as I was saying, that there's been more of an interest actually to working on their brand and brand strategy. And the reason for that is I think it's that longer term vision, that longer term strategy. So I think at the beginning, what we saw was a little bit of a reaction, and and, typically, having gone through the last recession back in 2008 and remembering that and seeing the reaction people had. And then it was, like, a little bit of a shuffling around, and then everyone kinda came back to, okay. Let's heads down. Let's let's keep on track. Right? Let's keep following our vision. So seeing that again, I would say there was that little bit of a reaction, but then they came back to say, okay. Well, we still have our long game. Right? We still are playing the long term strategy. Yes. We can work on tactics here and there to, you know, to react to what's going on, but the long term strategy needs to remain the same. Now we're taking into context what's happening. But, again, for for our clients in particular, we're working b to b tech. They've probably never been busier, a lot of them. So it's kind of a strange situation for them for a lot of the companies who are out there working on, you know, totally remotely, and they're using a lot of these b to b tech tools and products and services, they're seeing an uptake. Now the other thing is what we've seen as a difference is that they're coming back to those grounding principles that I've said. Right? So now we're seeing more of a focus on how do we keep our employees engaged. Right? We're seeing a lot more of a focus on employer brand as well as, you know, your external focus brand. And, basically, what it was, if you think about a lot of tech companies and they invest heavily in their offices and having these wonderful workspaces with, you know, lots of stuff, suddenly, we don't have that anymore. So it's really that time to reflect on, well, what is it about our company that makes us different? If we don't have all of those perks, if we don't have all of those things, what actually makes people want to work here? And, you know, I've worked in amazing workspaces that had a lot of stuff, but if you don't like the work, you're not gonna stay. So it's coming back to that core. We talk about authentic branding. What is actually different, not what we say is different. It's more about what we what is the real differences in terms of our brand. So I think it's actually been I won't say a good thing because COVID has been horrible, but I would say for a lot of people, it's getting them to reshift and refocus on what's really important, where they really want to go, and how how they really want to become these amazing companies that are changing the world.

Mark Evans: Now working with b two b companies over the last twelve years, many of them are very product centric. That's all about the tech. Mhmm. It's all about, you know, a team of developers creating more and more features to make the software increasingly sticky and attractive and serving the needs of different types of users. What about some of the mistakes they make when it comes to brand? Because I don't think a lot of them or I don't think enough of them are focused on brand and brand positioning and and brand storytelling for that matter. So from your experience, what are some of the mistakes that b two b companies are making when it comes to brand? What are the tools that they need to use or the approaches they need to use to realize that they are going in the wrong direction or they're not going in the right direction at all.

Karen O'Mahoney: One part was like that thinking it's one and done. Right? So that part of saying, okay. Well, we worked on our brand strategy and we're we're delivering on that. It's like, yeah. But maybe things have changed. Right? So your product has evolved. You're know, like, as you said, you've added all these new features. How has that changed your your company direction? Right? So maybe it was like a focus before, let's say, we're talking about a project management software. Maybe there was a huge focus before on, like, you know, the time management, time tracking, and all of that, and now you're moving into the financials. Well, now you're giving different benefits to your clients. Now you're you're positioned in a different way to them. They're already experiencing a different brand from the brand you're communicating. So now we want to get your brand ahead of you again. Right? So now we wanna start to say, your brand has changed. Your brand has evolved, and let's go back to thinking about where is it going. Right? So now just rather than in this world of, like, okay. We wanna pivot. We're gonna add new features. We're gonna move quickly. That's all great. But from a client perspective, I want to understand what you're becoming. Right? So I wanna understand where you're going to because I wanna I'm investing in you. Right? It's not just when we when we buy software, we're not just investing in it for now. Right? We're we're typically putting all our data into it. We're using it every day. We're getting more and more invested. So you wanna see that the company direction makes sense for what you're gonna need for your company direction. So I think a lot of the time, we don't see people sharing that. We don't see them sharing, here's where we're going. We see a lot of, you know, here's what we're doing, but we don't see a lot of here's what we're gonna become. And I think that's something that's often missing is that sharing of our own stories, own client experience, our own our own journey as a company, and what it's going to become.

Mark Evans: Let me ask you a difficult question only because I think it's gonna be a long answer. But what is what is BrandLucent's branding methodology? When you have a client that comes to you and they're struggling with their brand or they need a brand refreshed or they wanna create a new brand, what are the different steps that you take them through so that they go from not having a brand or a strong brand to having something that's compelling, that resonates, that actually makes a difference in terms of their positioning in the landscape?

Karen O'Mahoney: So we all start with our brand strategy. Right? So that's really, one of our major programs that we offer. And we do this in a very program centric way. We've created programs out of all of our services. And that's because we wanna give people a finite amount of time. We're saying, okay. This is gonna take this amount of time. It's gonna cost this amount of money, and you know exactly what you're getting up front, which I think is something that a lot of companies don't do because they're saying, well, it depends. What I'm saying? Well, I'm gonna tell you that this definitely does cost this much, and it definitely will take this amount of time. That's one thing that we want to commit to very early on because it give people the right expectations upfront. And I think when you're a service based business a lot of the time, it can feel very much like, will it go deep enough and so on? We've built this program so that it actually has gotten better and better every time we've done it, and that's because we're learning from our clients as well as we go. So we're iterating. We're building new areas of the business because of what we're learning along the way. So that's our brand strategy program. Typically, then it's a very exploratory process. We work, as I said, with the leadership teams. We work with them, we collaborate. We take it away. We we work on the creative side of things, and we come back with our major brand strategies and road map. And from there, we can say, okay. Well, here's our recommendations. Here's what you're gonna need to be doing. Now from there, you could take it any which way depending on what the recommendations are, but we typically work in areas like brand identity, brand naming. And brand naming could be, like, many sub brands, a few different products. If there's areas that we need to go into in more detail, like, let's say, if you do have multiple sub brands or you do have several different products, you might have a brand strategy for each of them. Employer brand, which I've talked about quite a bit already, and, obviously, brand success to help them along the way. The idea here is that we really are learning from them, spending a lot of time with them at the beginning, especially, to understand more about their products, their teams, how they work, what makes them different, how their processes work, how their approach works. Again, when we think about as you were saying earlier, you know, you're looking at a lot of product based companies who are investing heavily in their products, there's still some magic around the how, right, the the approach and how they work and how they typically operate and and how their support works and how they work in their teams. So we wanna harness that. We wanna really find out what's what's the special sauce. Right? What's the what's the authentic piece there that really sets them apart and makes them so much different from their competitors.

Mark Evans: It's been really helpful to to talk about brand because a lot of the times we're focused on tactics and how we can get stuff done and how we can make things happen and and the metrics and the KPIs around metrics. So brand and branding is extremely important. If you're a b to b company and you are looking to take advantage or move forward within this competitive landscape, I think a focus on brand is is a must do. Karen, where can people find out more about you? And as important, how can they learn more about BrandLucent?

Karen O'Mahoney: We're pretty active on LinkedIn, so definitely connect with us on there. Our Instagram game is getting better. We definitely are investing more in that, more time in it right now, but, obviously, you can check it out on our website, brandlucent.ca. I'd love to connect with anyone on LinkedIn. LinkedIn is kind of a replay. That's our field.

Mark Evans: Karen, well, thanks. Thanks a lot for for being on a guest on Marketing Spark, and thanks to everybody for listening to another episode of Marketing Spark. If you enjoyed the conversation, leave a review and subscribe by iTunes or your favorite podcast app. For show notes of today's conversation and information about Karen, visit marketingspark.co/blog. If you have questions, feedback, would like to suggest a guest, or wanna learn more about how I help b to b companies as a fractional CMO, consultant, and adviser, visit marketingspark.co/contact. I'll talk to you next time.